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October 21st, 2010
07:11 AM ET

Gay Scout Leader Removed

From Producer Vish Mapara

The father of a 9-year-old Cub Scout says he’s been forced out of a leadership role with the organization and ordered not to wear the uniform, because he’s gay.  Jon Langbert was part of the organization in Dallas, Texas.  The openly gay father says the scouts gave him the shirt to wear last year until other parents complained.  He was then asked to stop wearing the shirt and give up his leadership role position.  A representative from the Scouts says they have a policy that gays and atheists are not allowed to be leaders, so Langbert was never a leader in the first place.  The Scouts welcomed Langbert to volunteer his time, though not as a leader.

We want to hear from you.  Should the scouts take away Langbert’s role after parents complained, or should he be allowed to remain in the position?  Tell us what you think. Kyra Phillips may read some of your comments during the 10 o’clock hour of CNN Newsroom.


Filed under: Kyra Phillips
soundoff (43 Responses)
  1. mtravers

    I think that it was a good decision to remove the gay man from any serious role within the Scouts organization. With all of the political correctness going on in the world today we sometimes forget that homosexuality is a perversion. Which by definition is a sexual practice or act considered abnormal or deviant. This is not a good example for our youth. Its just good commonsense not to sanction or show approval for deviant behavior.

    October 21, 2010 at 8:01 am |
  2. Whitney

    If they have a policy that prohibits gays and athiests from being leaders, then they are justified in telling him he can't be a leader. However, being told not to wear their shirts is a little extreme, and even more so should they have investigated who they were making leaders in the first place. If he was openly gay, then at that time he shouldn't have been given the role. I don't really know how scouts works, but did they ever see how this might effect the gay guy's son?

    October 21, 2010 at 8:08 am |
  3. K Warren

    This mystifies me. This man has committed no crime, is an involved parent, yet he's being punished and humiliated. The presumption of innocence is an American fundament. The BSA is unAmerican.

    October 21, 2010 at 8:11 am |
  4. bt sullivan

    He is gay and has a son in the Cub Scout pack?? Did I miss something? They asked him to be one of the adult leaders of the pack?

    To be a volunteer with the BSA they run a background check on all Adult Leaders. Is this more an issue between National BSA, the local Council, the Pack and the family?

    October 21, 2010 at 8:18 am |
  5. Craig

    The father is irresponsible for exposing his son to institutionalized homophobia in the first place. This should be a nonissue, the BSA needs to disappear or reform. Hatred has no place in the teaching of our children.

    "Which by definition is a sexual practice or act considered abnormal or deviant."

    All sexual practices and acts are "considered" deviant by someone. Homosexuality is not a "practice or act", it is an orientation that exists in nature.

    October 21, 2010 at 8:41 am |
  6. rmreal

    Kyria

    Athiest and homosexuals each make up about 10 % of society and we all have our rights as citizen as do the bible thumpers and all people inbetween. Mos athiest know more about religion then the religious do that is why they are athiest.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:00 am |
  7. Pam Price

    Kyra.. Good report. You are so sensitive to the people you are interviewing. You had me in tears the other morning talking to the mom that lost her son. And, the after life story you seemed to be holding back tears of one of your experiences. Thanks & stay with it. Pam Pric

    October 21, 2010 at 9:02 am |
  8. Chris

    Do Kyra and CNN disapprove of atheists? I was a little disgusted by a comment I just heard her make on TV. When addressing the father, she asked how it feels to be grouped in with ATHEISTS(snarky attitude included). I guess somehow not having the same beliefs as Kyra means it is fine to be discriminated against by the BSA. Homosexuality is certainly off limits for discrimination, though.

    Sincerely,

    An atheist.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:03 am |
  9. Valeria T

    The BSA is a private organization, and they have the right to decide who is and who is not allowed to be a member. It's that simple.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:04 am |
  10. Cindy Branch

    I removed my son from scouting after learning of their policies. The last thing a developing child needs is UNACCEPTANCE for who they really are. The BSA organization is sending a scary, non-Christian message to our young people and it is reinforcing stereotypes in our adults. My son grew up to be both gay and atheist! I couldn't be prouder of him! He is a kind,loving, intelligent, independent thinker, who questions authority and other societal norms. He lives a more Christian life than most Christian "faithful" do.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:07 am |
  11. Polly Scanlon

    It is a tragedy that such a fine father and son have been shunned by the BSA, but everyone knows that they are anti-gay and anti-atheist.

    Frankly, what I am more upset about is your disparaging tone and comment "how does it feel to be lumped in with atheists"? How dare you say such a thing! This country is founded on the rights of the individual to be free of religious tyranny and that includes the freedom "not to believe" in a higher power. Your professed outrage over the BSA action is nothing but hot air. You have shown that you are equally biased.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:08 am |
  12. Chris

    While I support Langbert's efforts to be a Scout Leader, I do have to take Kyra to task on her opening comments. The point of this story focuses around discrimination against gays in te Scouts ( I support gay rights, BTW), but in the opening comments Kyra says to Langbert, "How does it feel to be lumped in with the Athiests!"

    If you you ant to be inclusive, then it needs to apply to everybody, not just your favorite groups. I'm not an Athiest, but it really makes my blood boil when people preach inclusiveness for some groups of people, then slur others.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:09 am |
  13. PDXCraig

    Thank you Chris(s). As an atheist, I appreciate when followers lend hand to support non or undecided believers.

    Most atheists ( I cannot say all), support spirituality. It is a freedom as you say, and we support it.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:13 am |
  14. J Jones

    I have been a scout leader for 15+ years and this situation makes me want to hang my head in shame.

    Fact: unless he filled out an adult leader form, he wasn't a registered leader and thus shouldn't have been wearing the leader's uniform. He could still be Popcorn Chair etc without being a registered leader. So from that point of view, they are correct.

    However, this policy is discriminatory and outdated! There is absolutely no valid reason someone who is gay can't be a good scout leader. As the father pointed out we have gays in politics, our military, excellent gay teachers, and gays in every job set. Being gay does not make them a bad leader!

    In our troop we teach the boys understanding and tolerance. I just had a dad come to me and thank me for those values I teach our scouts. His son was confronted by a passer by while selling popcorn and she brought up the gay issue with the scout. He told her that in our troop we don't discriminate against anyone for their beliefs or their sexual orientation. The scout actually handled the situation very maturely and I am very proud of him!

    What's next? Will we be telling boys they can't be scouts because they are gay? Will we be removing scouts that don't attend church on a regular basis? I strongly believe these are policies that needs to be changed!

    October 21, 2010 at 9:17 am |
  15. David

    This gay gentleman is smart. Therefore he knew the policy of the BSA before he and his son were engaged with the organization. Kyra must also remember that those in the organiazation must be reverent. This is in response to God. The BSA have interpreted this in light of the Bible which is opposed to this practice. It is unfair to gloss over this in order to get a story. Reverence is important to the BSA operation.

    Finally, even CNN has policies in which it expects its employees to abide by. What would happen if an employee decide to ignore CNN's policies? Ask the gentleman why he would decide to participate in an organization which will not allow him to become a leader. In addition, it would be just to give the BSA equal face time on your show.

    With much respect for all.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:23 am |
  16. RobD

    Thanks for the report. This is a perfect example where kids learn to bully.
    A major organization raising our children teaching them that its not only ok to discriminate but they encourage it. As a long time viewer I was a little taken with your comment about him being lumped in with the ateists as if being atheist is something bad. As a gay atheist I couldnt see a better group of people to be lumped in with. Once again thanks and keep up the good work.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:27 am |
  17. Kelly Garrett

    I am actually surprised that the father let his son join the BSA. They are known to be homophobic, and not much more than a christian recruitment organ. Why would a gay father want his son to join such a bigoted organization in the first place, then want to help them exercise that bigotry? Very strange. It is like gays buying Coors beer...what rock has he been under that he did not know who he was dealing with, and their history in regards to their opinions and practices towards our community?

    Yes, the BSA has the right, as a private organization to control who, what, when and where...and we know that gays and non-christians are not welcome there.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:27 am |
  18. Adriane

    I applaud this Dad and his son. The Scouts are obviously a discriminatory organization. I also want to say that I appreciate you, Kyra, always looking out for people of all stripes who have been discriminated against.

    In this particular interview, although I realize you were going for a bit of comic relief, I just had to say: Kyra, Kyra, Kyra, when you made the "How did ya feel being lumped in with athiests?" reference. Yes, athiests are on a rung lower than gays. I just wish you hadn't contributed to this last bastion of discrimination.

    Kyra, we athiests will survive your "slip-of-the-tongue(?)". And I will continue to enjoy your take on (most) things, after all, nobody's perfect—believers or non-believers.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:42 am |
  19. Jeff Raimer

    I think the son is incredibly aware and mature for his age and I stand beside him in his support for his gay father. He is a true American.

    On another note, Kyra owes an apology to the atheists in our country (of which I am one) for her blatant expression of disgust for ahteists as if we were some vile subgroup of humans. How discriminatory!

    Please apologize to your fellow Americans!

    October 21, 2010 at 9:54 am |
  20. D. Lance Jones

    Let me first set up where I am coming from. I have been a Scout leader and parent for over 15 years. I have3 boys. The oldest is 21 and made it to Star rank. My middle son is 15, Life rank, and starting his Eagle project. My youngest is 11 and is a 2nd class Scout. I was the Cubmaster for our Cub Pack for 6 years and have been the Scoutmaster of our Troop for the last 2 years. As an adult leader my only requirements for parents and adult leaders is that they are good parents and are involved with their son's Scout experience. My Troop teaches tolerance of all beliefs, thoughts, or whatever. We are diverse world and I teach that we all must live together to make this world work. When I see reports such as this it saddens me to know that there are still people in this world that have a such narrow view that they are willing to hurt a boy's experience in Scouting. I would welcome that father in my Troop. I need his help as I always need good volunteers to provide the best experience for my Scouts. As with all boys, his son would be a great addition to the family of Scouts that my Troop is.

    Sexual orientation, religious belief, political view, or whatever DO NOT determine the quality of an individual as a parent. The quality I look at is the interest to be involved in a boy's life. To provide him the best chances to succeed in this world. To develop his leadership skills and life skills. And to show him how to do this by getting into the outdoors and have fun doing it. If more parents, such as this father, would do this don't you think we would have a better world?

    I do not agree with BSA on these policies. But as an adult leader and volunteer it is my duty to my Scouts to "help" BSA to see that policies put in place during a less tolerant time in history are out of date and are in need of change. Thank you.

    Lance Jones
    Scoutmaster
    Troop 319

    October 21, 2010 at 10:08 am |
  21. Matt

    Its a disgrace that the BSA discriminates against homosexuals. I am a Scout in the UK and The Scout Association welcome anyone regardless of race, background, gender or sexual orientation. We even have a Gay Scout Fellowship. Athiests still aren't allowed in Scouts here but thats because its one of the fundamentals of Scouting to have a faith (whatever faith it may be).

    October 21, 2010 at 10:10 am |
  22. cari morang

    The father i feel did nothing wrong. Yes, he exposed his son to homosexuality but he (the son) would learn about it some time. Schools and Communitites teach what it is. So how can you say he was wrong, unless the School and Local Communities are wrong also. And we have the right to wear what we want whether the public likes it or not! Its called our first amendment. I understand if other parents do not what their children around it, there is an answer for the don,t take them their or start your own boys scout group. there are plenty of gay familys out there should they be discriminated because of their sexual views? No, they shouldn,t but everyone does it or not. This country needs to act real and face the real problems not gay or lesbians.

    October 21, 2010 at 10:56 am |
  23. Kelly Garrett

    Matt,

    Atheism is a faith...it is a faith that there is no "god." Just because they do not believe in a conscious, planning "god" does not mean they are not spiritual. So, the BSA wants those of faith, but not those of spirituality? I am not an atheist, but I do know many. Most are much more "spiritual" than any christian I have met, they just are not religious. It could be said that Buddhists are atheist, or non-theist...so, I guess they are not welcome, as well.

    October 21, 2010 at 10:59 am |
  24. Steve Leong

    Comments like the one before mine by mtravers are the hateful, mis-informed type that hurts, and creates doubts in young gay youth of why they were created different! These discriminating individuals need to learn that they WILL be held accountable !

    God created Gays for God's reason. Curb the world's overpopulation, find loving parents for children abandoned by straights ... gotta trust in God's plan. God doesn't make mistakes, and if anyone took the time to know a GLBT person, or studied the community, they would learn immediately that they did not CHOOSE this life style. It was a gift of God!

    The boy scouts can go on discriminating against Gays. Gays don't need to be victims to this though! Create the "Scouts of the World". Use God's creativity, and make something that is inclusive rather than devisive ... No wonder the nation is so devisive today! Hopefully the new generation will help make the USA united, again!

    Steven Leong
    Hawaii

    October 21, 2010 at 11:14 am |
  25. Kelly Garrett

    D. Lance Jones,

    The question is not whether being Gay, Buddhist , etc. makes one a good father. Under the BSA rules, however, they do determine whether one can be a Scout Leader. They are who they want to be...if that is not acceptable, then do not join them. There needs to be a place for everyone, just not the same place. If the BSA wants to keep their separate fellowship then they should be allowed to do so, and that is where people with those personality traits can provide the environment for their children that they think reflects their values. To change the BSA would deny these individuals and families a place to go. If one is of another mind-set, they really should form their own organizations. Being gay, I do not like their position at all, but they have every right to have it. My children didn't want anything to do with the BSA, and if they had I would have "explained" their philosophy to them...but, they figured that out for themselves. If this father's boy wants to leave the BSA, he should...he definitely should not expect them to change.

    October 21, 2010 at 11:16 am |
  26. Edwin

    Even though I went through the Cub and Boy Scouts and my mother was a scout mistress, I've always seen the BSA as a fascist organization based on nationalistic propaganda. Their attitude towards gays is despicable and forms homophobia early on when kids are most impressionable. Of course there's carry over in this attitude toward gays in the military. If this guy is given a shirt to honor his leadership, let him wear it, so long as he's doing no harm. His openness is far preferable to the hypocrisy of those many leaders hiding in closets just so they can be near youngsters. Saying he can be a volunteer, not a leader, is as ridiculous as the churches which preach a gay can worship with them but not take the eucharist.

    October 21, 2010 at 11:29 am |
  27. Ray

    I am a Cubmaster of a pack in the largest Council in the BSA and this has been an on-going discussion. We have parents who are leaders and also happen to be athiests and gay parents. The Council knows this and has approved. Here is what I have been told – (1) it is the Council's policy that the chartering organization of an individual unit knows best who the leaders should be (2) the Council will not interfer for any reason (other than criminal) in the selection of such leaders and will not permit the discrimination against anyone becoming a leader for resons of "faith choice and/or sexual orientation" (3) as the largest Council in BSA, they understand that the National Headquarters is aware of the Council's policies and has determined not to overide them.

    Here is the take-home point – BSA would dearly love to get beyond the 2001 Supreme Court decision that is at the root of the problem. It is a big problem for them in more liberal parts of the US. However, in locales (such as Texas, where the National Headquarters is located) there is a decidely different attitude toward gay parents and gay leaders. National would LOVE to have the 2001 Supreme Court decision overturned – it is an albatross around their necks. Overturning it would provide them "cover" to institute a nation-wide anti-descrimination policy. One might call this a bit gutless but the fact of the matter is that Scouting is very popular in regions of the country that have traditionally been opposed to gay rights. If they were to institute a policy that is counter to the 2001 Supreme Court decsion, they would risk a mass defection from Scoutting in many regions. Until the Decision is overturned (or until society in certain regions catches up), they are wink-wink-nudge-nudge with individual Councils and are essentially allowing different policies in different regions of the country, based upon the political winds in that region. It is an unenviable position to be in. One would hope that National would "do the right thing" but realpolitic comes into play. I think if someone digs deeper into this story, what they will find out is that the Council in this particular area responded not by dismissing the Cubmaster but by defering to the wishes of the Pack's chartering organization.

    October 21, 2010 at 11:31 am |
  28. Sarah

    Kelly,

    Atheism is not a faith, for most. It's a question. Most atheists believe that there is probably not a god, but acknowledge that we do not know for sure. The few who have faith that there is no god have no proof of it, which is what makes it "faith"–believing in something for which one has no evidence.

    October 21, 2010 at 11:36 am |
  29. Lee

    This is shameful he is a great father trying to be involved in his sons life and volunteering to help out his sons scout troop the boys scouts are retard & bigoted and should be banned if they don't get with the times and stop discriminating against loving & involved parent based on his sexual orientation which he cannot change.

    October 21, 2010 at 12:08 pm |
  30. Michael

    Let me say that, as a scout leader, I am ashamed of this decision. Please do not stereotype all scouts based on the narrow mindedness of the leadership responsible for this extremely un-scout like (in my opinion) attitude towards this man.

    October 21, 2010 at 1:40 pm |
  31. kanga

    Kelly,
    It does not take any faith to not believe in something for which there is no evidence.

    In Australia, there is no problem with atheists in scouting – way too many atheists in our population for that to work. No problem with sexual orientation, either.

    October 21, 2010 at 5:31 pm |
  32. Scott

    I too am an adult leader in Scouting and have been for about 10 years. Where I live has a very high lgbt population and this misunderstood "policy" has been totally blown out of proportion. Nothing in the Boy Scouts of America prohibits LGBT's from being leaders. THERE IS NO SUCH POLICY! Call the national office if you don't believe me.

    All Scout Groups, (Packs, Troops, Posts, etc.) are chartered by a LOCAL community organization who recruit their leaders and select them using their own group requirements. Scouts are made up from community people for community people. The only National requirement is that leaders subscribe to the Scout oath and Law and are of "good moral character" . Good Moral Character is decided by the local chartered organization. I hope this message reaches people. I too know and work with LGBT folks in the scouting program. I also know there are LGBT scout leaders. It's not a national issue. Let me repeat ITS NOT A NATIONAL BSA POLICY!

    Now That being said Sexual behavior of any kind has no place in the scouting community. It is not the place for its debate, recognition, understanding, tolerance, or acceptance. Nothing in the scouting program involves sex, gender, marriage, etc. Its about the boys not about your own personal feelings or preferences.

    Lets keep it that way.

    October 21, 2010 at 7:05 pm |
  33. Mary

    According to the BSA, The 10 purposes of Cub Scouting are:

    1. Character Development
    2. Spiritual Growth
    3. Good Citizenship
    4. Sportsmanship and Fitness
    5. Family Understanding
    6. Respectful Relationships
    7. Personal Achievement
    8. Friendly Service
    9. Fun and Adventure
    10. Preparation for Boy Scouts

    Before asking this parent to step down and not wear his uniform, this pack should be revisiting the purpose of scouting as well as the 12 core values. How can they emphasize and teach character development when making decisions about leaders and volunteers based on sexual orientation? They should instead teach their scouts the value of character, service, and commitment that is given by parent volunteers. This man should be commended for taking such an active role in his son's activities. He has not done anything wrong or broken any rules, and the fact that he still has his son in the pack after all this shows he has character. He is putting his child first.

    For those unaware parents, shame on you for putting this man's name in the mud not only for him, but for his son. This has to be humiliating for them both.

    October 21, 2010 at 8:31 pm |
  34. Bev

    What lesson is this teaching the boys who know and like this man – intolerance and judging others is fine? Common BSA, join the 21st century.

    October 21, 2010 at 8:57 pm |
  35. omegga

    @ mtravers
    ok, so let me start off with the fact that i am a openly gay man. I am not flamboyant, flaming or other wise fit any of the sterotypes placed upon us. I was born and raised in a bush town in northwestern ontario. where i grew up with just wood for heat. i can also hunt, fish and build things. If i didn't tell people that i was gay no one would ever know. I have taught others in my area how to survive in the bush. Can you please tell me how being gay is a perversion? you obviously have no idea what t is like to be gay. To have to hide, never to be able to hold your partners hand in public or other wise have any of the luxurys that straight people take for granted in dating. By saying that being gay is a perversion, is saying that it is a choice to be gay. Why in the hell would anyone chose to be gay? why would i chose to live a life where i have to hide my feelings, or recieve hatred from small minded, bible thumping, inbread homophobes. With my life experience i would be able to survive in the bush, hunt , gut, and skin a moose. Most scout leaders would love to have my experience in the bush to teach todays youth. That is another thing what is the big deal if the guy was gay? not only could he teach the kids how to survive in the forest he could also teach them how to survive society, bullying, hatred and other torments that gay kids have to deal with. By removing him from his position, how do you not know that they also removed some kids support systym, which could cause a whole chain of events that could end horriably because of small minded people that think being gay is a perversion. So tell me how am i being devient? because i chose to be in love with another man, I am not a christian and never will be. how could i live with a belief that the god i would have to believe in chooses who he loves? And just remeber if you do believe that being gay is a choice, it would be just that ! my choice where do you have any place to tell people how to live their lives and what to believe in exspecially if you don't have a clue what it is all about. Until you live it. you can't preach it.

    October 21, 2010 at 9:34 pm |
  36. Cristina Chuecos

    I was blown away Kyra's question to the dad on how it felt to be compared to an atheist. While she plays the role of a tolerant person that embraces all kinds of diversity it became quite clear that religious diversity is not one of them. Being atheist does not epitomize evil. As shown by a CNN report a few weeks ago, most atheists educate themselves on religion, and make and educated decision on how to view theconcept of God and religion.
    The most important thing I learned from my theist uncle was that people must do the right think simply because it is the right thing to do, not because they are afraid of what God might do if they don't. Why would anyone be offended to be compared with someone with those kinds of values?

    October 22, 2010 at 7:42 am |
  37. Mary

    I think it is past time for all people to learn how to respect and obey the rules of any organization to which they might want to join. And if they can't accept the rules then they are troublemakers in the first place. No wonder kids are a problem these days. They grow up watching their parents create trouble at every point.

    October 23, 2010 at 8:39 am |
  38. Ron S.

    I recently applied to become a leader for the cub scouts. No where on the application did it ask me for my sexual orientation or my religious beliefs. In their literature regarding the families in cub scouts, the BSA has identified three types of families that exist for their boys; married, single and non-traditional. As a member of scouting for over 20+ years I am deeply disappointed and will let my local council know.

    October 23, 2010 at 10:16 am |
  39. jaye bea smalley

    It is times like this when I question the level of involvement I have with this organization. While my council has a no discrimination policy, I have to imagine a day will come when my son may be questioned on being part of a discriminatory organization. There are so many things wrong with this case. First of all, it was a poor example and harmful to the boys in the troop. What is the message? If you are a good father who has strong leadership skills you are stripped of them and then your child is humiliated? Then the parents need to start discussing homosexuality with their kids which is really not appropriate in this manner. It can only go two ways: " Well we aren't predjudice against gays, but we participate in this great club anyway", or yes, "I know he is a nice daddy and a good leader, but he is does not deserve to be a leader because as you know, homosexuality is a sin". Nevermind that the people who took away his uniform probably practice heterosexual acts that aren't up to bible standards!
    Furthermore, I fear this puts our children in a terrible position in terms of safety and vulnerability to sexual predators. Look at all of the perversion files that BSA has covered up. Now they get to pay $25 million in punitive damages for cases from the 60s-84.
    Deron Smith statement on the Langbert case and the policy is priceless, "Our mission is to take young people and prepare them for exceptional adulthood". If humiliating a committed leader of a pack member is the policy. I think the exceptional adults you are going to create will definitely have an exceptional adulthood. It will be defined by exceptionally poor judgement related to the welfare of community and young people. Similarly, they will also make exceptionally bad decsions based on this incident when raising their own families and in the workplace. Deron Smith, based on your comments the national council has more interest in defending BSA's past perverts and defending a discriminatory policy which plagues the organization and its members with problems rather than moving into the 21st century and truly focusing on character development, strong values and leadership qualities in a safe nurturing environment.

    October 23, 2010 at 11:05 pm |
  40. liz ahn

    If we, as a country, want to stop the violence and bullying of gay youth, the suicide of gay youth; then we need to teach tolerance to our adults. It starts with them. The mentality of adults filters down to the youth whether we like it or not. Until kids learn from experience (through their parents, teachers, what they read, who can be in the military, who can be a scout leaders, etc) that gay is just another way to show affection and love another human being, that is is acceptable, then the violence and bullying will continue. It needs to start at home.
    Let the boy's father wear the uniform. Or, if live was really fair, all the other fathers would NOT wear the uniform in respect to the gay fathers rights. That might happen in Australia but in the US, ah, sorry to say, we're too backwards socially.

    October 25, 2010 at 8:30 am |
  41. Kelly Ragan

    As A Straight American man, I see why the scouts wouldnt want this guy to be a leader, He might try to teach those impressionable young men some silly things like, Compassion for others, understanding, what a good dad does with his son, how to stand up and take a shot for everyone not just looking out for yourself, OMG it could just get crazy. Look at the leadership of this country, they teach good ole' American values, how to lie just to get votes, how to tell lies and villify another man and ruining his name just to get the vote, using pressure to get funding for your projects that benifit your "Campaign" funds,, Good ole American values. GET REAL this guy is a real Dad who is doing what every other "man" is supposed to do, and They tell him to kick rocks for his sexuality??? I wish I lived near these folks so I could hang out with them and take notes on how a "Man" is supposed to behave,,,, Shame On the BSA....

    October 26, 2010 at 8:54 pm |
  42. Kelly Garrett

    jaye bea smalley,

    Well, when I was in management positions where I was doing, or vetting, new hires being a scout was a negative and their application was file 13'ed. Being a member of a hate group is already affecting them in the workplace.

    October 28, 2010 at 12:22 pm |
  43. Rob

    As an Australian scout leader I was very interested to read all this debate about the BSA and it’s discriminatory policies. I can at least reassure all you guys, that here in Australia there is no discrimination for race, creed, religion and sex, and not that of sexual preference either, in scouting. Yes, we have gay scout leaders and also girls participate in all levels and age of the scouting program, combined with the boys. Scouts are just fine here thanks and flourishing, the sky hasn’t fallen in and the wheels haven’t fallen off. It WILL work if you give it a chance. I also note that there is no influence or chartering by churches and religious organisations in Australia, perhaps therein lies the BSA’s problems… From the perspective of scouting for all in Australia, we are following the original ideals of Baden Powell who founded the movement and offered scouting to all youth. Perhaps the BSA has deviated somewhat from this path and is not really scouting any more? Perhaps they have tarnished the scouting brand? Perhaps from that perspective they should not be allowed to function using the brand of “Scouts” any more, they are actually something different, touting as a "private" organisation, quite apart from real scouting which is an international movement. They should change the name and remove scouts from their moniker, as from the original ideals of BP, they are not that any longer, but some other perverse version.

    November 1, 2010 at 6:15 pm |